Cruiser Command

Cruiser command is a cooperative map between two teams. Simply put, each team controls one battlecruiser and the goal is to kill the opponent's battlecruiser.


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 Post subject: Re: Destroyer revamp
PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2015 8:17 pm 
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Dreadnought wrote:
Well you have to limit the amount of drones in some way (so spammy without adding limits to that missile in construction), and makes a destroyer able to deal with a BC more directly, and benefits even more if multiple destroyers use this ability.


err.. to me the resource cost of a missile would limit the amount of drones, vs the energy of a destroyer

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 Post subject: Re: Destroyer revamp
PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2015 10:35 pm 
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slapshot wrote:
Dreadnought wrote:
Well you have to limit the amount of drones in some way (so spammy without adding limits to that missile in construction), and makes a destroyer able to deal with a BC more directly, and benefits even more if multiple destroyers use this ability.


err.. to me the resource cost of a missile would limit the amount of drones, vs the energy of a destroyer


just energy? we can cooldown lock it and give a maximum amount, or even hide it behind an item, similar to the minelayer distress beacon

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 Post subject: Re: Destroyer revamp
PostPosted: Sat Mar 28, 2015 9:49 pm 
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Dreadnought wrote:
Ill take whyte-dragons Shield Core...and Iron screen is a rip-off of Iron Curtain and directional defensive abilities annoy me :|

Ok, so what about abilities that augment the quantum bombardment...
For example the destroyer starts with: Particle Accelerater - applies a buff to the destroyer, the buff stays until the destroyer fires a quantum bombardment. Removes the buff but gives the quantum bombardment 25% speed. 15 second cooldown. The buff will not stack (for now... ^^)
So essentially...I use the Particle Accelerator ability, and my next quantum bombardment will be 25% faster, however its up to me when i fire that quantum bombardment. I can hold on to that buff for 10 minutes if i dont fire off a quantum bombardment. Also, if i fire the quantum bombardment after 15 seconds of activating the buff, that means i can activate it again Immediately for the next quantum bombardment (though keep in mind quantum bombardments have 5 second cooldowns, so i can only use the particle accelerator with 1 out of every 3 quantum bombardments, and if i wanted to use it twice in a row i would have to skip 2 rotations of bombardments).
So thats the ability that people start off with, but we can add MOAR with upgrades.

Enhanced Trackers - requires T2 20 :y: 100 :b: 5 :g: 15s cooldown - increases homing range (distance when it starts moving to an enemy) and tracking abilities (how fast the projectiles can turn) by 50%
Saturated Explosives - requires T3 50 :y: 125 :r: 10 :g: 25s cooldown - increases damage by 25%

These abilities will not replace other abilities, therefore you can have all 3 active buffs at once, which is far more interesting, as each ability on its own sounds dull and generic, but you can combine them to create your own unique buff, (since there are already 10 variations with just 3 buffs)

Also fun other ideas ~~ You can target which direction you want your next quantum bombardment to go *like a wraith's EMP*
Your next projectiles are cloaked :lol: The qauntum bombardement fires all at once *instead of 5 projectiles fired in rapid succession, it will fire them all at once*. When fired, the next quantum bombardment will have a CD of 2 seconds down from 5 seconds....lots of fun stuff you can do xD instead of having boring damage upgrades, we can can increase a destroyers effectivness overall by the amount of buffs it can do...we can even rip off Leech and chroniton and apply them in a similar fashion ;)


Dis is still bestest Idea, thoust hasth not come up with something exceedingly excellent comparith to mine. We shall apply quantum buffs to the most grand of creations, the destroyer by glorious patch 5.0

Kappa

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 Post subject: Re: Destroyer revamp
PostPosted: Sun Mar 29, 2015 11:21 am 
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Dreadnought wrote:
Dis is still bestest Idea, thoust hasth not come up with something exceedingly excellent comparith to mine. We shall apply quantum buffs to the most grand of creations, the destroyer by glorious patch 5.0

Kappa

They really, really aren't.
I didn't want to spend the effort in explaining why I thought it was a bad idea, but if you so insist...

None of those suggestions further the destroyer in any way as a concept. All you have put forth is a bunch of extra fluff that's only purpose in being added is to have 'more filler.'

Particle Accelerator is silly. You're assigning a buff to a seemingly random cooldown to empower an ability that is channeled, such that it gets an arbitrary power spike on a whim. Moreover, it's described in such a way that it would not function along the new destroyer design, so I can only assume you therefore would want to keep the original destroyer design with it which only further makes it a bad idea in my mind. There's nothing 'smart' or 'interesting' about it -- there are dozens of ways you could have made this more interesting by attaching conditions, such as making the 'speed' increase the longer it was channeled. However, having it simply be attached to a button is arguably the most boring way.

The new destroyer was suggested to be more like a laser. I honestly don't think tracking would even be necessary -- just give it some of the projectile speed other ships have. The tracking was only necessary before because the shots were so slow and so far in between it was necessary to attach a small helper in order to allow it to have a little more accuracy. Considering the new firing rate, I would actually advise against tracking. The moment you give it tracking is the moment the destroyer becomes overpowered due to the absurd number of projectiles it shoots off. It would be like playing bullet hell where all of the bullets were constantly moving towards you if you got within 100 pixels of them.

Saturated Explosives is just damage. While necessary as a basic upgrade, I fail to see how that's in any way how that's suddenly a 'new neat idea.'

Dreadnought wrote:
These abilities will not replace other abilities, therefore you can have all 3 active buffs at once, which is far more interesting, as each ability on its own sounds dull and generic, but you can combine them to create your own unique buff, (since there are already 10 variations with just 3 buffs)

It's not more interesting. Very little about this changes how you view your ship or its abilities on either a combined or individual level. They're bland in such a way that while they do help you, "it's not something you'd care about."

Infiltration is interesting because it puts a spin on how you view offensive actions in cruiser command. It takes an entirely different approach to attacks as to what's commonly accepted by small ships and battlecruiser combat.

Allowing small ships to shoot missiles is interesting because it adds an extra dimension of thought in to how you approach battles, how you prepare for them, and how you deal with them.

Broadsides are interesting because they require you to pay attention to the relative positions of your battlecruisers. It's only sad that battlecruiser movement isn't as common now.

Tractor beam is interesting because it directly influences an opponents position. Since its influence is also relative to the weight of an object, it actually becomes incredibly rewarding to make a successful hit with a tractor beam against a small ship since it requires dead on aim but offers greater results.

None of any of the upgrades you suggested above do anything like that.
All you end up doing is the same thing as before, except the numbers become slightly better.


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 Post subject: Re: Destroyer revamp
PostPosted: Sun Mar 29, 2015 8:20 pm 
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WhyteDragon wrote:
The moment you give it tracking is the moment the destroyer becomes overpowered due to the absurd number of projectiles it shoots off. It would be like playing bullet hell where all of the bullets were constantly moving towards you if you got within 100 pixels of them.


And that's ignoring the lag that would be caused by having to calculate a tracking trajectory for each individual projectile

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 Post subject: Re: Destroyer revamp
PostPosted: Sun Mar 29, 2015 10:31 pm 
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slapshot wrote:
WhyteDragon wrote:
The moment you give it tracking is the moment the destroyer becomes overpowered due to the absurd number of projectiles it shoots off. It would be like playing bullet hell where all of the bullets were constantly moving towards you if you got within 100 pixels of them.


And that's ignoring the lag that would be caused by having to calculate a tracking trajectory for each individual projectile


He doth not understandith the great Kappa involved, but also the quantum bombardment (and other missiles and mines) already has tracking and doesnt cause any noticeable lag, have you seen the merculite missiles in action against small ships? they insane ~_~

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 Post subject: Re: Destroyer revamp
PostPosted: Mon Mar 30, 2015 1:01 am 
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Dreadnought wrote:
slapshot wrote:
WhyteDragon wrote:
The moment you give it tracking is the moment the destroyer becomes overpowered due to the absurd number of projectiles it shoots off. It would be like playing bullet hell where all of the bullets were constantly moving towards you if you got within 100 pixels of them.


And that's ignoring the lag that would be caused by having to calculate a tracking trajectory for each individual projectile


He doth not understandith the great Kappa involved, but also the quantum bombardment (and other missiles and mines) already has tracking and doesnt cause any noticeable lag, have you seen the merculite missiles in action against small ships? they insane ~_~


This is running under the assumption that we go under the most boring route and attach your upgrades to the already existing destroyer and make that 'the entire revamp.'
Which is not even a revamp at all in reality.

If we assume that it's the channeled version suggested in the new destroyer design, there could potentially be many projectiles per destroyer on screen, all requiring tracking.

The scale you're suggesting is blatantly different.


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 Post subject: Re: Destroyer revamp
PostPosted: Mon Mar 30, 2015 12:27 pm 
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"By blue thunder, what a mess we have created"


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 Post subject: Re: Destroyer revamp
PostPosted: Mon Mar 30, 2015 1:09 pm 
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Dreadnought wrote:
the quantum bombardment (and other missiles and mines) already has tracking and doesnt cause any noticeable lag, have you seen the merculite missiles in action against small ships? they insane ~_~


due to the fact that those are currently at a low count - and most of the time the tracking is "off" because there aren't any targets within the tracking range - if you increase the tracking range, you increase the amount of checks that need to happen, and likewise if you increase the projectile count to absurd numbers

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 Post subject: Re: Destroyer revamp
PostPosted: Mon Mar 30, 2015 3:25 pm 
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DinoChicken wrote:
"By blue thunder, what a mess we have created"

??

slapshot wrote:
Dreadnought wrote:
the quantum bombardment (and other missiles and mines) already has tracking and doesnt cause any noticeable lag, have you seen the merculite missiles in action against small ships? they insane ~_~


due to the fact that those are currently at a low count - and most of the time the tracking is "off" because there aren't any targets within the tracking range - if you increase the tracking range, you increase the amount of checks that need to happen, and likewise if you increase the projectile count to absurd numbers


K....your right, and its just a template anyways so it hardly matters, we can easily change it to something absurd, like if you get close to that projectile(s) it will instantly teleport to your position and detonate, or rework the 20% damage increase because ya its ridiculously generic (but very easy to write out) and instead, each projectile when it hits an object, it will produce a shockwave in the form of a cone hitting any other stuff behind the object, good for dealing with ships hiding behind the enemy BC's shields like wimps that they are. That sort of stuff, but the basic aspect remains the same, it comes from an activatable ability that buffs the next quantum bombardment.
Or whyte-dragons swat cannon, its fun, but 30 dps a second (60 damage every 2 seconds, and a 20 degree cone is quite small, so ships at a small distance will get hit by all 3) and fired in any direction makes it a very good counter to enemy corvettes and wraiths that will sit behind the destroyer so that they wont take the quantum bombardment, which involved having your own escorts to keep them from mauling you from behind. Simple, increase the cooldown to 10 seconds. Then add fun stuff, instead of a simple 3 projectiles, have like 20 projectiles that fire, each doing 4 damage, (and not all at once, channeled over the course of 1 second), its more of a soft-counter to ships exploiting the destroyer's weakness then a serious full on anti-ship weapon O.o

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