Cruiser Command

Cruiser command is a cooperative map between two teams. Simply put, each team controls one battlecruiser and the goal is to kill the opponent's battlecruiser.


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 Post subject: Engine Boost
PostPosted: Thu Apr 04, 2013 4:10 pm 
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After playing a bunch of maps, I've come to understand just how powerful Engine Boosts are. They're a make or break of combat that feels so essential that it basically allows you to leap across the map at the small expense of a little power. So, for those unfamiliar let me just list a few things...
  • The current cost of Engine Boost is 200y 50b 200r. I find this to be a good price considering the potency of the actual engine, but it's still very manageable.
  • (IMO) Those with Engine Boost are able to easily control the flow of combat if the opposing team lacks it. It is extremely simple to 'escape without issue' using one swift engine boost, giving ample time to either make preparations for combat or simply wait for the next boost. Most players will not be able to close the distance in time. On the other hand, it's nearly impossible to escape from someone who has an Engine Boost due to the distance covered.
  • Engine Boost is something operable on navigation. One of the most painful parts about moving a BC alone is that you have to go back and forth between the Energy Console and the Navigation Console. But with Engine Boost, you can simply operate it all from navigation without any sort of macro difficulties.
  • Many consider Engine Boost to be absolutely 'core' for the game. It's something that cannot be done without. Isn't this already an implication that this ability is a bit overdone, if it literally makes or breaks a BC?

Anyways, I think the blunt of the situation is that it's a bit too powerful for its cost once researched. So I'd like to offer an alternative suggestion:

Instead of making it cost BC Energy to do a boost, make it cost some resources, I.E. 10y 15r. "Burn resources" for that extra jump. That's the sort of cost people will cringe at in the beginning, making them think twice about utilizing it immediately as a better method of movement. It also forces people to stockpile a bit further if they believe it's going to be a prolonged battle, and also puts a situation where people may think to use normal Engine Power instead of the Boost in order to conserve resources early on. (Though I think in the case of a rush, most people would still boost one for one if both had. However, if only the escapee has it, it puts a small hamper on resources that he wouldn't have had to deal with originally.)

Any thoughts on this?


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 Post subject: Re: Engine Boost
PostPosted: Thu Apr 04, 2013 9:12 pm 
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i like it, people rely and boost to move them instead of standard engines and this will make for emergency situations...a real emergency

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 Post subject: Re: Engine Boost
PostPosted: Thu Apr 04, 2013 9:37 pm 
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CCA
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The resource costs sound reasonable.


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 Post subject: Re: Engine Boost
PostPosted: Thu Apr 04, 2013 9:55 pm 
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Red-Rocket wrote:
i like it, people rely and boost to move them instead of standard engines and this will make for emergency situations...a real emergency

Exactly. It's a way of creating a possibility for balance without extensively altering the actual mechanics of the thrust. Moreover, it does something that I would personally like to see more of in the game; adding an alternative usage to resources, so that they still have a point even once you hit end game. (Right now, Kerm/Pyro has a lot of use due to Yamato/Core Cleansing, but it feels like the Hull Increase is massively overlooked due to the imbalance of usage between Blue/Yellow resources. Most people would prefer to Powerdock rather than increase hull, which requires a lot of yellow. Same issue with missiles, though that costs more red in most cases.)


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 Post subject: Re: Engine Boost
PostPosted: Thu Apr 04, 2013 10:17 pm 
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as far as the vision the maker had anything that the bc does as a function should consume energy as it does it, minerals are for constructing or expanding on a technology i do like the idea but i dont agree on mineral consumption to make it happen, maybe the amount of hull damage the bc takes should be increased a margin to prevent mass engine boost spamming?

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 Post subject: Re: Engine Boost
PostPosted: Thu Apr 04, 2013 10:26 pm 
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or make it cost more energy.

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 Post subject: Re: Engine Boost
PostPosted: Thu Apr 04, 2013 10:28 pm 
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Tempest wrote:
as far as the vision the maker had anything that the bc does as a function should consume energy as it does it, minerals are for constructing or expanding on a technology i do like the idea but i dont agree on mineral consumption to make it happen, maybe the amount of hull damage the bc takes should be increased a margin to prevent mass engine boost spamming?


Yamato Cannon costs resources to prepare.
Core Purging costs resources.
Missiles cost resources, and could be considered not so different from firing lasers.
You can buy Small Ship equipment.
You can buy Equipment to do ship work.

I don't agree with that either. If you're referring to solely the Navigational Panel, then I'd understand, but minerals are most definitely used for more than research.

Also, if you make it hull damage than you'll simply spend 15y 15b to repair the hull regardless. It literally makes no difference except for the few seconds it takes to go to the tech console and instiresearch it.


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 Post subject: Re: Engine Boost
PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2013 12:02 am 
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thats a well thought out response, but i still argue that an engine boost is an expansion upon normal movement rates, the yamato cannon is an exclusive weapon shot, not a hyper mode to laser cannons (in that case a weapon cap cost should be included) i believe that if engine gw costs power depending on the wattage, engine boost should cost power as well. The problem here is frequent use of the skill, a solution would be hull damage increases higher on engine boost velocity more so than regular engine velocity due to the sudden acceleration.

my mineral post was not accurate but action - reaction is what im looking at here. It doesnt make sense for minerals to be spent per boost to an engine at a conceptual standpoint, if there is a problem with the frequency of boost a more realistic solution would be needed rather than a mineral cost per use. You dont throw minerals into the engines to make them go faster :p

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 Post subject: Re: Engine Boost
PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2013 12:21 am 
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Part of me really likes this idea. A mineral cost attached to the engine boost solves a lot of underlying problems with this upgrade (mainly, its too good, not having this upgrade means you can never kill someone with this upgrade), and it adds a bit of strategy. I don't think this solution goes far enough though, for two reasons:

One, it becomes an upgrade that you can potentially not be able to use. You spend the (relatively large) price on engine boost, but you don't actually get a benefit until you have more money. This sets off red flags for me-- none of the abilities that cost money to use also require a large investment to upgrade in the first place. I have a real worry that this will drive a wedge into newer players/player teams that don't finish their powerdock by the 15 minute mark.

Two, kinda contradictory to point one, but money is not a good way to restrict access to something. Veteran teams have some stellar mining income (viewtopic.php?f=12&t=173). This doesn't even count using the mass rep. While I don't know if this will make it more efficient to use the BC's regular engines to travel, it will still maintain the importance this upgrade has in combat.

I think the solution to this needs more to it.

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 Post subject: Re: Engine Boost
PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2013 1:01 am 
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15k energy to boost.


call it last resort.

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